AntLog - double elimination result logging tool

Place discussions about upcoming events here in this thread.

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EpicentrE
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Post by EpicentrE » Mon Dec 07, 2009 10:19 am

A Zip file, Peter? The only file on Gary's Website for Antlog is just antlog.ots, which is here http://homepage.ntlworld.com/g0xan/robots/antlog.ots. Do you maybe have some compression software (Winrar or 7zip, maybe?) that's seeing the Open Office file as a compressed folder (as this is kind've how Open Office files work, in a way, I think) and uncompressing it? If so, if you just go to Open Office Calc, and file>open the file (before it's uncompressed) then this should work. I would also imagine there's a option somewhere in Open Office to re-associate the relative file type (.ots, in this case) with Open Office, if indeed that's what the problem is.

Hope this helps!
Scott Fyfe-Jamieson, Captain of Epic Robotics. Champion of AWS38/41/42.
http://www.epicrobotics.co.uk

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peterwaller
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Post by peterwaller » Mon Dec 07, 2009 11:27 am

Cheers Scott that helped a lot.
Windows Vista insists that the file downloaded is Antlog.zip and if I double click on the file windows decompresses it.
I have tried renaming it Antlog.ots but it still tacks the .zip on the end.
The only way I have found I can run it is by going into Openoffice Calc and opening the file, then it all appears to work.
Gary this looks very good we will just need to ensure someone brings a laptop with them to events.
As to the double elimination on the final my charts never covered that and I am not really convinced that it is a good idea anyway. I beleive the final should be just that.

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Post by peterwaller » Mon Dec 07, 2009 11:38 am

It is even better with macro's enabled.

EpicentrE
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Post by EpicentrE » Mon Dec 07, 2009 11:55 am

I'm glad you managed to get it working, Peter. It's possible it's a Vista-specific problem, as I'm running Windows 7 and, as I said above, I had no problems with it whatsoever.

Gary, I think it's worth mentioning that Open Office seems to set macro security to high by default, meaning that it won't even ask you if you want to enable them. People will have to change the security level to medium, then open the file and select "Enable Macros" for it to work as intended.

About the final in double elimination, we've always done it that way. The entire point of double elimination is that you have to lose two fights before you're out of the competition, and it's only completely fair if that rule applies to every single robot, no matter what happens. The way our system is set up, you will always have a robot in the final that has not lost one fight, and a robot that has lost one. If the robot from the losers side then won, then both robots would have lost one each, making it even. Especially as it's possible to have two robots fight earlier in the competition, then again in the final (as with Void and Anticide at AWS30). If I'd won that first final fight, it would've been 1-1 between us. I think it's the difference of what "seems right" to the robots who are actually fighting, compared to what is logically fair in the scope of the whole tournament.

I don't mind it not being on the charts; at the end of the day the people who are running events know how the system they are using works - and it's obviously their jurisdiction which way they choose to do it.
Scott Fyfe-Jamieson, Captain of Epic Robotics. Champion of AWS38/41/42.
http://www.epicrobotics.co.uk

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Post by leo-rcc » Mon Dec 07, 2009 1:50 pm

EpicentrE wrote:I'm glad you managed to get it working, Peter. It's possible it's a Vista-specific problem, as I'm running Windows 7 and, as I said above, I had no problems with it whatsoever.
I am on Vista here and it downloaded it as a OTS file just fine.
Best regards,

Leo van Miert.
Dutchrobotgames
Team RCC website

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Post by leo-rcc » Mon Dec 07, 2009 3:29 pm

I just did a test, the sheet works really well, kudos to the maker.
Best regards,

Leo van Miert.
Dutchrobotgames
Team RCC website

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BeligerAnt
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Post by BeligerAnt » Mon Dec 07, 2009 9:46 pm

Thanks for the feedback everyone.

Scott, you're right about the default macro security setting, I need to add that to the instruction sheet. I have also figured out how to do the double final - it wasn't as hard as I feared.

Peter, I'm not sure what in your system is causing the problem, especially as it works for Leo in Vista. Probably some deeply buried setting somewhere...

I would like to improve on the system to avoid fights re-occuring in the losers stream. However, I haven't yet figured this out on paper, let alone in a spreadsheet, so don't hold your breath for this one. If anyone does manage to figure it out, I'll be happy to have a go at coding it.
Gary, Team BeligerAnt

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Post by peterwaller » Tue Dec 08, 2009 8:58 am

The other thing that would really save some time on event day would be if it could do the draw splitting same team and same frequency robots into different groups. :roll:
It would need to do at least two different draws for non and full spinner events so you don't repeat many of the fights.
I would like to improve on the system to avoid fights re-occuring in the losers stream. However, I haven't yet figured this out on paper, let alone in a spreadsheet, so don't hold your breath for this one. If anyone does manage to figure it out, I'll be happy to have a go at coding it.
If you take the loosers from the second round winners fights and cross them over with the other half of the group you greatly reduce the number of duplicated fights it is just difficult to show in the diagram.
Also at the last event we were getting close to 48 robots so if numbers continue to improve we might need to go up to 64.

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Post by BeligerAnt » Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:52 pm

peterwaller wrote:The other thing that would really save some time on event day would be if it could do the draw splitting same team and same frequency robots into different groups. :roll:
It would need to do at least two different draws for non and full spinner events so you don't repeat many of the fights.
I deliberately left this part out!
a) James would be out of a job :D
b) I tried to do it once before and a PC can't react to "oh dear my robot's died, I'll have to pull it from the competition" as quickly as humans can
c) The algorithm is actually quite complicated as it has "random" and structured elements. IMHO humans are better at this.
peterwaller wrote:If you take the losers from the second round winners fights and cross them over with the other half of the group you greatly reduce the number of duplicated fights it is just difficult to show in the diagram.
That sounds like it should work, but it gets quite complicated to code the links in the spreadsheet "on the fly". Maybe something to try if I get really bored sometime...
peterwaller wrote:Also at the last event we were getting close to 48 robots so if numbers continue to improve we might need to go up to 64.
Agreed, this is a fairly simple change. Most of the effort is in creating the templates for up to 16-way groups. Not difficult, just a bit tedious.
Gary, Team BeligerAnt

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BeligerAnt
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Post by BeligerAnt » Sat Mar 20, 2010 9:12 pm

Antlog had its first real test today at RRC, and performed well I think.

Now if we run an event at a venue with wi-fi available, we can have the complete results published on the net as soon as the event is finished! :D
Gary, Team BeligerAnt

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